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Arnob's Cbr250R Detailed Long Term Review


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#151 Silver Phantom

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 01:41 PM

 L.P., on 23 March 2012 - 08:27 AM, said:

Arrey I was just kidding Man, :) Take it with a pinch of Salt :P
Done.. Taken with a Pinch of Salt, Some Oregano, and Chilli flakes too... :D
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#152 maverick1

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 03:58 PM

 arn, on 11 August 2011 - 07:16 PM, said:


Hi Arn. I am new to motoroids and  infact unware about  bike scene in India from past 5 years due to being Abroad, but i believe i have decent mechanical/ tech knowledge so am able to grasp details.  I am planning to buy a bike in 200cc-250 cc category and need your advice amd of fellow forum members

I have been reading this blog and others from past 5 months, reading ownership reviews, new bike rumours, test drives reviews, long term reviews etc.
Like many i can easily and honestly comment that your ownership review is honest and most clinical. You have been honest and detailed as someone can be :).

Regarding my Dilemma -

I had pulsar 180 Dtsi ( all black colour sceme) bought in 2005 which i sold during mid 2007 as it had to leave country from some years.
Now i basically drives a VW Vento TDi but miss my biking days hence want to buy one.

Why did i Bought Pulsar 180 dtsi- i loved the revving nature of the engine and good cornering ability ( apache was not lauched then ). I also quite liked the exhaust note and not to forget all black colour scheme.

My Driving style- I used to drive in and around Pune for going to trekking spots like Lohgarh, Rajmachi etc and to travel to Mumbai in rains for fun. While engine had grunt otherwise bit it used to gasp for breath on Ghat section as well as seats were not comfy for touring.

What do i need now in a bike -

(i) Should be exciting to ride, should have exciting to hear  exhaust note and should look good

(ii) good pickup and good cornering ability, should have smooth engine, should feel it will last through anything.

(iii) should be easy to sell and have good resale as i plan to change bike after 3 years or so

(iv) good build quality and hassle free service

I test rode DUKE and CBR 250r and went and saw Yamaha r 15 as no TD was available for it!

Duke- first TD was on Demo Bike - with just 54 km on odo !

Looks - Looked Really good, big , mean and menacing certainly had eye catching look with lots of character
Build quality best i have had seen on indian built bike

Engine and gearbox- engine i felt is not that refined, gears were hard to engage, never even once i was able to find neutral

Exhaust note- it was noisy, not deep grunty the way i prefer, had lots of mechanical clatter

ultralight and flickable

Second test ride- on a brand new bike just after PDI -  first one to ride it even before the owner- on side note- i would not like to be that owner .

gears easier to engae still had chug chug noise while downshifting, still unable to find neutral, touched 92 km/hours felt no signs of being unstable at that speed with a pillion.


CBR 250r- 2011 edition- TD vehicle probably had 2000kms plus on odo as confirmed by Sales guy

Looks - looked good but i did not like the headlight or tail end  that much, would have preferred certainly cbr like looks in comparision Yamah  r 15 headlights as well as tail end looks fabulous just the size of bike brings it down.

overall good looking bike but could have looked lot better- design has no heart racing element in it.

If i go for CBr would certainly work on its looks

ENgine - gearbox- excellent smooth shifts, smooth revving engine

the pickup felt lot better then duke in a way that it had that sudden rush of accelaration , ifelt a jolt when i twisted the trottle

exhaust note- quite good when revved if only if it was louder !

Fit and finish- handlebar and switches ugly- rubber on leavers  cheap, bolts on handle bar were corroded.

second Test ride on CBR 2012 HRC - bike was again a demo- probably ridden once or twice but cant be sure as did not look at odo.

Looks fit and finish - vastly improved then 2011, can safely say quite close to Duke not still better though.

New HRC colour- my personnal opinion is it loosk quite good, though that red sticker on side fairing would have looked lot better if the red in sticker was same as red on front fender.

TD- engine had harshness right from 3000 or many be  from 2800 or so and upwards. i felt vibes in my hands and somehow felt fairing also vibed though not sure entirely.
pickup was less, that punch felt earlier in TD 2011 CBr was missing ,took it all the way till 98 km/hour on same road as Duke.

Was not so sure this time that i had lot better pickup then duke as i felt earlier felt it had better but by a very small degree.

Took the cbr 2011 again for just 500 meter td if you can call it a td yesterday and felt it had vibes from 3500 onwards which i did not feel last time on same bike!

I am confused- idid not like duke overall as i felt engine is over stressed, exhaust note not good enough, in second TD looks did not have same arresting feel as first time. I feel with more dukes on road looks have the tendency to wear down.

CBR- loved it first time except looks  and also would lovew to have more grunty pickup, higher pickup

I can extend my budget till 2.25- 2.50 lakhs for a bike which has

- Better looks then CBR, gruntier pickup, better deeper louder exhaust note and also less soft front suspension.

- whatver i can read on blogs -  ony new bikes to be launched in 2012- early 2013 are -

suzuki baby B king - i did not like its pics no offence to me it looked ugly

yamaha 250 cc Aircooled Fazer- again no offence but i dont like looks of fazer at all

Hyusung 250cc- have read negative reviews about it also people have commented about its quality niggles, engine niggles so while it looks stunning in pics in somewhat Ducati red its OUT.

Triumph 250cc- just saw a sketch, no idea how the bike will look like or what tech details it may have. Triuph as a brand is good hence i am interested. Please provide any information about this bike.

Would have loved if there was  yamaha R15 look alike with 250cc and albeit with better seats and modern DOHC engine but could not find any rumour etc about it

please let me know if any news bikes are being launched other then the lot which i  mentioned as well as if my information is wrong or there is more information regarding the same



Regarding Any second hand bikes of higher CC like Ninja 650r, any idea of its price and where to buy etc? I am presently in Lucknow and can travel to Delhi if one is available.

In between CBr and Duke please advice if my observations are right or wrong. also am in right in believing that CBr suits my purpose more then duke.

Sorry for such a long post i actually want to buy a bike soon mostly withi in 15 days or so but do not want to regret it later hence looking at bikes which will be lauched and second hand bikes to be had!

If i  can get a  more powerful, better loooker, nicer exhaust note  etc second hand or  new bike  then i would certainly wait!

#153 NikhilB

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Posted 26 March 2012 - 04:39 PM

^^
Maverick,

As a Duke owner, let me tell you that the engine gets much more refined after the run-in period and gear shifts are smoother too.
But, it seems like you're eliminating the Duke on looks. Since that's subjective, so be it.

Also,
I'm intrigued that in your entire post you haven't mentioned the Ninja 250. Any particular reason why you are not considering it? I would think it ticks all your boxes.
If budget is a concern, you could consider buying one pre-owned. (Till something more exciting comes in the 250-400cc range)
I like 'em Naked.

My thoughts

#154 maverick1

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 08:26 AM

 NikhilB, on 26 March 2012 - 04:39 PM, said:

^^ Maverick, As a Duke owner, let me tell you that the engine gets much more refined after the run-in period and gear shifts are smoother too. But, it seems like you're eliminating the Duke on looks. Since that's subjective, so be it. Also, I'm intrigued that in your entire post you haven't mentioned the Ninja 250. Any particular reason why you are not considering it? I would think it ticks all your boxes. If budget is a concern, you could consider buying one pre-owned. (Till something more exciting comes in the 250-400cc range)

thanks for quick reply

ttill date i have not ridden ninja 250r, just sat on it.it looks superb though except teh headlamps. tthe reason i didnot coniser it that everywhere including international blogs andreviews it is agreed that it  has coniserably less torque at lower revs read below 5,000 then cbr and requires lots of downr shifts to keep  it on boil,  also that it is not as comfy as cbr this coupled with  high price, even second hand is 2.25 l, i did not consider it.

any other suggestions for second hand bike under or around 2.50?

#155 rahul_rn

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 11:01 AM

^^^
See whether you can wait till the GT250R, the news is its a new bike(which i doubt though)... But if it is then it can be a good bike for sure..
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#156 pulsurge

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Posted 28 March 2012 - 12:28 PM

//(i) Should be exciting to ride, should have exciting to hear  exhaust note and should look good//

The KTM scores over the Honda. As far as exhaust note is concerned on the KTM- I like it initially but after sometime, I feel like telling it "why don't you shut up" ;) Personal thought that- but nonetheless it feels more exciting to ride than the CBR.

//(ii) good pickup and good cornering ability, should have smooth engine, should feel it will last through anything.//

The KTM again for handling. Good pickup- whatever people might say about the KTM i.e. power to weight ratio etc., but I still feel the CBR despite on the heavier side is still a faster steed. Engine smoothness- well I'll give it to the Honda again- though not by a great margin. Last...too early to say. Both of these brands are known for their engine reliability.

//should be easy to sell and have good resale as i plan to change bike after 3 years or so//

I would say don't think about resale. After all the fun you have on either bikes- you should be least thinking about this factor.

//good build quality and hassle free service//

The new CBRs look much much better i.e. one of my friend bought the tricolour version. Though I would still give the fit and finish points to the KTM. Hassle free service- I will again give it to KTM- as experience wise I would say Bajaj Service Centres are much much better than Honda- I simply hate the attitude of these people, they behave as if the Honda brand is god-sent for  the Indians.

Not sure how good the roads are in and around Lucknow, but I would say the KTM is a much better mannered motorcycle when it comes to bad roads. Also very comfortable compared to the CBR- and just in case your old hobbies like driving/offroading to Rajmachi come alive, the KTM would do a better job.

CBR being more comfortable than the Ninja is a misconception. I was surprised when I rode one, it is extremely comfortable and has a lovely seat. Anyways one should not be comparing the Ninja anyways to the CBR- its just something else. Well price yes- on the much higher side and the parts don't come cheap either. So that's out of the equation.

My suggestion to you would still be the KTM.
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#157 ShamikB

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 02:59 AM

Got delivery of CBR yesterday, the tricolour one :)

#158 rahul_rn

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 09:16 AM

^^^ Congo man.. :)
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#159 arn

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 11:24 AM

Maverick 1, I cannot compare the CBR as I have not ridden the Duke, Ninja 250 or any of the other bikes you have mentioned.

ALL bikes get smoother (engines  + gearbox) after a few thousand km, and the only true way to compare bikes is to ride them back to back, being aware that there will be variations between individual pieces. I'd compare between the KTM and the CBR, discounting the others.

N250=orphan, Bajaj uninterested, will have guaranteed very poor resale value
Yam 250= Hot air till date
Suzuki= No info
Hyosung=Treats it's 650 customers like shit, best of luck with 250 purchase.

#160 maverick1

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 12:18 PM

 rahul_rn, on 28 March 2012 - 11:01 AM, said:

^^^
See whether you can wait till the GT250R, the news is its a new bike(which i doubt though)... But if it is then it can be a good bike for sure..


i read review of cbr vs ninja vs gt 250r  on motorcyclistonline.com where they reported certain grave quality issues as well as chasis being too big for the  motor, spongy lifeless brakes etc hence i stopped considering it. does 2012 model any different? any idea of its cost ?

#161 pulsurge

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 12:58 PM

 ShamikB, on 30 March 2012 - 02:59 AM, said:

Got delivery of CBR yesterday, the tricolour one :)

Congrats man...do post the tiranga pics :)
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#162 maverick1

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 01:10 PM

 pulsurge, on 28 March 2012 - 12:28 PM, said:

//(i) Should be exciting to ride, should have exciting to hear  exhaust note and should look good//

The KTM scores over the Honda. As far as exhaust note is concerned on the KTM- I like it initially but after sometime, I feel like telling it "why don't you shut up" ;) Personal thought that- but nonetheless it feels more exciting to ride than the CBR.

//(ii) good pickup and good cornering ability, should have smooth engine, should feel it will last through anything.//

The KTM again for handling. Good pickup- whatever people might say about the KTM i.e. power to weight ratio etc., but I still feel the CBR despite on the heavier side is still a faster steed. Engine smoothness- well I'll give it to the Honda again- though not by a great margin. Last...too early to say. Both of these brands are known for their engine reliability.

//should be easy to sell and have good resale as i plan to change bike after 3 years or so//

I would say don't think about resale. After all the fun you have on either bikes- you should be least thinking about this factor.

//good build quality and hassle free service//

The new CBRs look much much better i.e. one of my friend bought the tricolour version. Though I would still give the fit and finish points to the KTM. Hassle free service- I will again give it to KTM- as experience wise I would say Bajaj Service Centres are much much better than Honda- I simply hate the attitude of these people, they behave as if the Honda brand is god-sent for  the Indians.

Not sure how good the roads are in and around Lucknow, but I would say the KTM is a much better mannered motorcycle when it comes to bad roads. Also very comfortable compared to the CBR- and just in case your old hobbies like driving/offroading to Rajmachi come alive, the KTM would do a better job.

CBR being more comfortable than the Ninja is a misconception. I was surprised when I rode one, it is extremely comfortable and has a lovely seat. Anyways one should not be comparing the Ninja anyways to the CBR- its just something else. Well price yes- on the much higher side and the parts don't come cheap either. So that's out of the equation.

My suggestion to you would still be the KTM.

first  of all really thanks for a detailed reply, i hope other forum members also give some valuable advice imputs as this reply has confused me.
I am confused by your post regarding duke vs cbr. (i) Should be exciting to ride, should have exciting to hear  exhaust note and should look good// regarding this point you mentioned duke is more excitingto ride, how?

regarding pickup and exhaust note i agree completely ,more so from engineering perspective i believe duke engine to be lot more stressed then cbr hence the exhaust note has mechanical clatter as well as it is bit screatchy , also important point to be noted here is that even being naked bike with smaller engine albeit with high revving nature it gets heated a lot . how the engine will hold after a certain km has to be seen yet.

regarding engines, i was under impression that ktm is not compared with honda in terms of reliable engine just like alfa romeo cant be compared with toyota :tape:  , please do suggest correct me if i am wrong.

The KTM again for handling - i test rode both of them twice , once both of  them back to back on same rode and i took duke till 92 and cbr till 98, well cant say about high speed stability as till that speed both were stable, but i think cbr cg is lower and mass is more centralized as being heavier it felt as light as duke.  yes on diff forums people have said that cbr is mroe stable post 100 by a wide margin, is that true in your experience . have you rode duke for a long period of time  etc. please clarify regarding handling as it is quite important for me

does duke has smaller turning radius then cbr? i


i agree regarding fit and finish still duke has better finish in plastic etc but i think its 19-20 difference now also duke has lot less to show as it naked ;) so lot less panels to compare or  to fault!

if you check naked pics of cbr you will find it looks verybit as good as duke in terms of mechanical beauty

Not sure how good the roads are in and around Lucknow, but I would say the KTM is a much better mannered motorcycle when it comes to bad roads. Also very comfortable compared to the CBR- and just in case your old hobbies like driving/offroading to Rajmachi come alive, the KTM would do a better job

roads in lucknow are good ,around lucknow not much idea as of now, but people have pathetic sense of driving specially two wheeler junta. No one follows lane culture here. which brings me to a point both cbr and duke has most pathetic horn i have ever heard in a battery powered bike.


KTM is a much better mannered motorcycle when it comes to bad roads. Also very comfortable compared to the CBR- and just in case your old hobbies like driving/offroading to Rajmachi come alive, the KTM would do a better job
- i am confused regarding it- you mean to say duke has better handling on abd roads and comfortable too, i have read in some forums cbr has more plush suspernsions and is better on bad roads, yes i felt that front suspension does nose dives butthat should affect handling not comfort on the contrary it should aid comfort.

 arn, on 30 March 2012 - 11:24 AM, said:

Maverick 1, I cannot compare the CBR as I have not ridden the Duke, Ninja 250 or any of the other bikes you have mentioned.

ALL bikes get smoother (engines  + gearbox) after a few thousand km, and the only true way to compare bikes is to ride them back to back, being aware that there will be variations between individual pieces. I'd compare between the KTM and the CBR, discounting the others.

N250=orphan, Bajaj uninterested, will have guaranteed very poor resale value
Yam 250= Hot air till date
Suzuki= No info
Hyosung=Treats it's 650 customers like shit, best of luck with 250 purchase.

thanks Doc, ( please let me know whether to address you as doc or arn)

i hope you ride duke soon enough so as i can get some inputs

true regarding individual pieces. first ride of duke was negative while i went with hopes of booking the bike, such was the excitement on forums regarding duke and so in mags that i was impressed before even looking at it.

first ride was on demo duke hardly 54 km on odo - faced many probs of finding neutral, hard gearshifts etc, second was on brand new duke just after pdi, finding neutral problem remained but gears were lot smoother

#163 rahul_rn

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 05:09 PM

 maverick1, on 30 March 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

i read review of cbr vs ninja vs gt 250r  on motorcyclistonline.com where they reported certain grave quality issues as well as chasis being too big for the  motor, spongy lifeless brakes etc hence i stopped considering it. does 2012 model any different? any idea of its cost ?
Ya i know the current gen is a fat dog on which you will be riding, but heard rumors that the next gen has addressed its issue's.. and pricing might be good considering its elder brother prices then maybe 2 around lakhs..
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#164 pulsurge

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 08:10 PM

 rahul_rn, on 30 March 2012 - 05:09 PM, said:

Ya i know the current gen is a fat dog on which you will be riding, but heard rumors that the next gen has addressed its issue's.. and pricing might be good considering its elder brother prices then maybe 2 around lakhs..

If it looks like this...its going to sell man...IT WILL SELL...at least the poser value will be far far greater than the CBR, KTM or even the N250R. This one looks BIIIIIG:

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Just for size...the GT250 looks like a 600 :)

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#165 pulsurge

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Posted 30 March 2012 - 08:33 PM

1)Revvy and throaty sounding engines always feel exciting to ride :)

2) I don't think the exhaust has a mechanical clatter...a short stroke fast revving engine is bound to sound like that. Also stress am not sure- even the bigger KTMs sound crazy. A naked bike will have more air flowing over its engine than a faired version...in the end its a water cooled engine. So no worries on the cooling part.

3) KTM winning Dakar races and other endurance events are a proof of their engineering and reliability.


4) I didn't ride the Duke for long..it was a small test ride. But then it was decent enough to get the hang of the bike. Hit 148 kph yday on the CBR- and it feels amazing planted. Am sure on the KTM you will feel a tornado hitting you. But then how often do you hit these speeds? Handling of the KTM, well can't say- though I found it really well planted flicking and sudden braking etc. I did see Yogesh Gehlot negotiating a few tight and wide twisties and he was doing it absolute effortlessly. I think you can ask people in the KTM ownership thread about the handling.

5) I feel the KTM will turn in a shorter radius than the CBR..though haven't measured it- but feelwise.

6) Naked or faired....quality is quality!

7) The CBR is a faired bike and KTM a naked...and I doubt if you are going to strip down the fairing of the CBR ;)

8) The KTM am sure will score in traffic, as its much much easier to manouvre than the Honda. Getting louder horns is half an hour job. Even Superbikes come with punny horns.

9) KTM is more upright compared to the forward lean position of the CBR. So lesser stress on your wrists and shoulders. Also an upright position means you rest completely on your butt. CBR's suspension is good too, but that slightly front lean position makes the KTM take the comfort score.
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